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SSchultz0956 · Oct 10, 2006, 10:52 AM

Ok.

We are in Iraq, Iran will possibly have nuclear weapons within the next two years, and it is possible N Korea could be fairly close if not already there. We are distracted in Iraq, so what do we do?

THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT CUT AND RUN OR BUSH'S POLICY ON IRAQ OR Whether IT IS AN ILLEGAL WAR! Instead I want to hear what you think about what can be done with the current situation we HAVE to live with.

NeedKarma · Oct 10, 2006, 10:54 AM

Let's step back one second - what is it assumed that N. Korea will use its weapons on the US?

SSchultz0956 · Oct 10, 2006, 12:53 PM

In all seriousness, do they not teach about the korean war in Canada? No need to step-back because it is widely known they hate us. We know this through their rhetoric, they hate us because of all the sanctions that we have imposed on them, they hate us because of the war, they hate us because America is one of the most advanced Democracies in the world and we don't like it when people take upon themselves the title of dictator supreme which and deprive their people of human rights such as eating, which is exactly what they have done.

However, whether they want to launch nukes at us is not the point. The point is that they would be even more inclined to sell their nukes to Osama, Hezzbolah, and other terrorist organizations because their country is practically bankrupt (they already would be if it weren't for their supernotes).

NeedKarma · Oct 10, 2006, 01:50 PM

Korean war? 50+ years ago? You don't think things change in 50 years?
And the USA is a republic not a democracy. Do you hate all communists because they are communists? Same with socialists? Same with liberals.

Well you seem to have your mind set anyway, no use in me posting here.

Have a great day!

bhayne · Oct 10, 2006, 02:35 PM

North Koreans hate us because of their isolation. They are brought up to hate us so they do!

North Korea in all probability will not use nuclear weapons on North America. They are too easy a target for payback. What is very probable is that they sell it to a terrorist group for commodities that they have been restricted from (like fuel, explosives, uranium, ect) and then an old ship sails into New York harbor and Ka-Boom.

Instant economic disaster and kaos with 5M dead and no one will know were it came from... And the streets in Iran will be celebrating! And that woman broadcaster on North Korean News will be giggling like she was when she announced the nuclear test!

SSchultz0956 · Oct 10, 2006, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by NeedKarma

Korean war? 50+ years ago? You don't think things change in 50 years?
And the USA is a republic not a democracy. Do you hate all communists because they are communists? Same with socialists? same with liberals.

Well you seem to have your mind set anyway, no use in me posting here.

Have a great day!

WOW! You are certainly arrogant. Yes, I hate communism and socialism and any leader who upholds such governments. THe people don't know any better, but so far you have successfully said NOTHING about the topic of this thread. And actually, America is a Republican Democracy:) Get YOUR facts straight.

And NO, things politically do not change in 50 years. Russia and China still hate us and that was BEFORE the korean war. Why don't you come to the US before you socialists in Canada start assuming you know what we are about. (Socialist Canadians like you, not referring the population as a whole)

Fr_Chuck · Oct 10, 2006, 07:17 PM

For North Korea, I am not sure there is anything we can do. Clinton had a great treaty with them except they broke it. The 6 nation talks with Korea offered them food, oil, raw materials and everything even a official relations with the US and diplimats in the US, but Korea refused to agree to any of the offers.

So I am not sure that there is anything we can do at this point but let them do what they want to do, or try and put some pressure on China to force Korea to do something ( they are the only ones with the power to make them do anything)

Iran, they just hate Isreal and the USA, not because we are in Iraq ( although that does not help) but only because we stand for freedom of choice, religion and speech. They have hated us before Clinton, during Clinton, during Bush and will still hate us no matter who is elected. They way they work at destroying the US will depend on the policies of those in power.

Iraq, US has a lot to do with setting them up in power and it just went bad, like who did not see it coming. And we also need a great base in that part of the world. And their area was a great training area for terrorist. I won't say we did not need to invade, since their people were little more than slaves to a evil dictator, but the issue is now, will they fight for their freedom or do they just want us to fight for them.
If they will not soon start fighting ( each person like we did in the US for our freedom) every man in Iraq should be lined up to join the police force to fight for his nation, unless something like this happens, honestly we need to pull out since we can't win the war for them, they have to win the war thierself.

And the nation you left out is Pakistain, they have atomic weapons already if I understand it correctly, a large percentage of their people support the terrorist groups, The military is divided in loyality, and most likley they are hiding some of the terrorist and was the reason many of the leaders escaped.

While they talk about being our friends, their actions don't show it a lot.

SSchultz0956 · Oct 11, 2006, 10:42 AM

I think it is interesting how all of a sudden N Korea has threatened war if we impose sanctions on their country. I'd like to see that. They wouldn't last too long against russia, china, japan, s korea, and the US.

Fr_Chuck · Oct 11, 2006, 07:17 PM

I think you are giving too much credit to China and Russia,

I don't think that N Korea would do anything with out at least a nod form China, since without them they have no fuel or raw material.
And Russia would like nothing more than to see China and Korea fight the US, which would leave them as someone to help supply mateials to various nations

NeedKarma · Oct 12, 2006, 08:42 AM

You may find the comments in this thread of interest to you:
http://www.digg.com/politics/The_Tru...in_North_Korea

CaptainForest · Oct 12, 2006, 09:01 PM

Originally Posted by SSchultz0956

In all seriousness, do they not teach about the korean war in Canada?

For the most part, no they do not. It is a quick footnote, but we do not spend much time learning about it at all.

We spent more time learning about the assassination of your President Kennedy than the Korean war.

Originally Posted by SSchultz0956

Why don't you come to the US before you socialists in Canada start assuming you know what we are about. (Socialist Canadians like you, not refering the the population as a whole)

Yes, because we are all a bunch of socialist commies.

Just because Canadians have different views than Americans, is no reason to put us down.

You don't here us calling you a fat, arrogant, lazy, opportunistic, selfish, greedy, unethical American, now do you?

tre_cani · Oct 12, 2006, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by CaptainForest

For the most part, no they do not. It is a quick footnote, but we do not spend much time learning about it at all.

We spent more time learning about the assassination of your President Kennedy than the Korean war.

That's OK, we didn't learn much about your country's government either... and I grew up in Detroit (a stone's throw from Windsor, Ontario).

Originally Posted by CaptainForest

You don’t here us calling you a fat, arrogant, lazy, opportunistic, selfish, greedy, unethical American, now do you?

I think we just did. How is it that being a called a Socialist (aren't you?) warrants such name-calling?

CaptainForest · Oct 13, 2006, 12:28 AM

Originally Posted by tre_cani

I think we just did. How is it that being a called a Socialist (aren't you?) warrants such name-calling?

Wow.

Obviouslly you aren't familiar with sarcaism.

I have nothing against most Americans. A huge portion of my family are American and live there.

Just sometimes, certain people get on my nerves. I don't judge an entire country by the actions of a few.

Originally Posted by tre_cani

That's ok, we didn't learn much about your country's government either...and I grew up in Detroit (a stone's throw from Windsor, Ontario).

You are right there.

I was once in Florida on vacation when I was asked, "Where do you come from". I replied Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Then, they seriously asked me if I lived in an igloo.

Sometimes ignorance is sad, and with some people, it does exist.

Most of the time I try to stay out of voicing my opinions on US domestic issues, not always, sometimes.

But seeing the education system and other things in the US, I'm glad to be living in Canada. (some US states scare me, others are not at all bad)

bhayne · Oct 13, 2006, 06:44 AM

The main reason that I believe Canadians take a 'let's sit back and watch approach', is because Canadians have nothing to worrry about. I mean, attacking Canada is worse than attacking 30 Afganistans.

Not only would a hostile force have to spread so thin to cover our vast wilderness, they would have to contend with scorching hot summer days followed by freezing cold winter night. Just the thought of having to deal with our Indian population would turn the average person off!

Meanwhile, our neighbor is a prize. Nice hot and easy environment. Well populated.

If you take Canada, you probably won't last a year (unless your from Siberia). If you take US, you've upset the world's balance of power! Also in US, you don't have to rebuild your igloo each year!

But not all Canadians are narrow minded and think only for themselves. Personally, I take the 'get them before they get you' approach. Even if the 'you' is US, not Canada!

I guess you might say that I'm a team player.

tre_cani · Oct 13, 2006, 07:28 AM

Originally Posted by CaptainForest

Obviouslly you aren't familiar with sarcaism.

No, but I am familiar with sarcasm, which I hoped was evident in my response to your comments. Sorry for the misunderstanding. It must be that US educational system.;)

talaniman · Oct 13, 2006, 09:43 AM

Make it simple, Korea is the puppet of China and Iran is a terrorist state. Both of these countries exploit and keep there people in ignorance and poverty so they can be manipulated for the goals of the ruling classes. What can be done? You don't want my answer.

Morganite · Oct 13, 2006, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by SSchultz0956

Ok.

We are in Iraq, Iran will possibly have nuclear weapons within the next two years, and it is possible N Korea could be fairly close if not already there. We are distracted in Iraq, so what do we do?

THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT CUT AND RUN OR BUSH'S POLICY ON IRAQ OR WHETHER OR NOT IT IS AN ILLEGAL WAR! Instead I want to hear what you think about what can be done with the current situation we HAVE to live with.

The best way to get on with other nations, especially if gunnboat diplomacy and "bomb 'em into submission" policy has failed, is to make friend with them.

Above all, be consistent. Don't just pick on the little easy to beat guys and nations, if you bomb Iraq because it is run by a tyrant who threatens the west, then you have to do the same to China. When white man speaks with forked tongue is made as plain as it has been with this WH, then it is time for a change.

Diplomacy is not the art of browbeating, but the art of understanding those who are different, and it does not involve thinking that your way is the only way, or that your ideas are the only good ones. No one likes a bully, and any foreign pooicy as clearly founded on brutishness as this WH's is needs removal and impeachment fior the danger and cost of lives it has brought into the world by its inane bumbling. Sure, NK is a threat, but why is it? Because it was named as part of the AXIS OF EVIL by the leader of another country who sought to marshall support for his ghastly actions and policies in the ME.

Although it is not considered red-blooded, it is manful to take the heat for one's own mistakes, and to calm the troubled waters of the world, instead of throwing around ultimata like a sailor on leave throws his cash aorund.

The USA needs statemanship, but its only got politicking.

My 2c

M:)

phillysteakandcheese · Oct 14, 2006, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by talaniman

...Korea is the puppet of China...

While that is mostly true, the now confirmed nuclear test that DPRK carried out (without China's approval) now causes a real problem in the region.

The DPRK has some very serious problems to deal with, but above all else they want regime survival. I don't think Kim Jong Il is crazy, I think he's pretty savvy in stirring up a hornets nest of trouble that gives him a card to play in trading appeasement for the survival of his government.

31pumpkin · Oct 16, 2006, 08:46 AM

Well, as a last resort the U.S. can always nuclearize(build up) small nuclear weapons to South Korea & Japan.

The news is fresh every day & today it looks like the sanctions are promising towards the North K. It's just a shame that Kim Jong Il would have his people starve because of his defiance.

Meanwhile Pres. Of Iran still crying "hegemony!" regarding the U.S.'s influence in the U.N.
I think the leaders have to deal with the priorities of each day accordingly.

The N. Korea problem looks very promising to me. Iran looks "iffy" but not chaotic. Patience- I hope they both can be worked out diplomatically of course.

talaniman · Oct 16, 2006, 09:03 AM

Originally Posted by phillysteakandcheese

While that is mostly true, the now confirmed nuclear test that DPRK carried out (without China's approval) now causes a real problem in the region.

The DPRK has some very serious problems to deal with, but above all else they want regime survival. I don't think Kim Jong Il is crazy, I think he's pretty savvy in stirring up a hornets nest of trouble that gives him a card to play in trading appeasement for the survival of his government.

No way I buy China has no influence on N.Korea since they send a lot of food and fuel to them. Publicly China may disapprove but behind the scenes is another matter in my opinion. They bear watching. As for Iran I have no doubt that they have a hidden partner or to giving them support as well. Both of these small countries is seeking something with embarrassing us (US) as a tool to draw us into some kind of bad position. Hopefully the diplomats can resolve this ( IF Bush lets them) otherwise a lot of people will be in a lot of trouble.